It’s a very good day when I show up just 10 minutes late.
Depends on the situation. Meeting up with friends? I wouldn’t blink at them being 10 minutes late. Opening shift at a cafe? 10 minutes would put me so far behind I’d be in big trouble.
Honestly, if I get the job done and do it to spec, managers can shut the fuck up.
My job doesn’t care if I’m late, and my productivity has not changed
You ever ran late to a college class because you had to stay longer than scheduled at your shitty retail job to cover your perpetually late coworker who was supposed to relieve you?
Sometimes running 10 minutes late is no big deal, but sometimes it is. It becomes a problem the moment it causes someone else problems.
10 mins late to an office job where they get their 10m back, AOK.
10 mins late to cashier/sales gig where you’re relieving someone else, not great.
10 mins late to a meeting is bad
10 mins late to class is bad.
Really depends what you are 10 minutes late for. A meeting with other participants, ok if your role is to sit and listen. Not OK if people are waiting for you to start. It’s not OK to be late to relieve a co worker either
That’s how you build anticipation
Is this post serious or just making shit up? Ive never heard anyone claim that 10 minutes late is on time. Late and on time are mutually exclusive words. Whether your work punishes it or not is a different question, im permitted to be 5 minutes late and it counts as on time for example.
This seems more like a post designed to piss people off and make them fight over a position noone had before reading it.
This is cultural appropriation of italian culture
I’ve always told my daughter to never show up on time because it sets a bad precedent. No one cars if the person whose always late is late. Everyone freaks if the person whose always on time is late.
Eh. This depends on the job being done. In my field of work the only thing that matters is that you get the job done. What office hours you keep are not very important. On the other hand, my friend works shift work where he has to replace someone directing a process (think air traffic control). Being 10 minutes late is a dick move because you are forcing the person you are replacing to stay longer at the end of a shift.
Then shifts should have an overlap.
I know they don’t and won’t, but there’s no good reason not to do it, except that the company would make a bit less money.
Depends on how things are run. My wife works at the hospital and works 12 hour shifts, rotating days and nights. You’re expected to show up 15 mins early so the previous shift can hand off their patients to you.
I’m not sure how you’d do 12 hour shifts with overlap unless the overlap was considerable or shift times were all over the place. The hospital here gets a certain budget and it makes sense to have it running as optimal and efficient as possible. You also get paid from punch in to punch out so coming in early gets you paid more. Realistically her shifts are 12 hours 15 mins.
But then your wife should be scheduled and paid for 12.25 hour shifts.
She gets paid for it, it’s just not on the schedule. There’s no unpaid labour at her work.
By listing a schedule starting at one time, but expecting the actual start to be earlier they’re communicating an inaccurate schedule.
Could you imagine prescribing one dose but expecting another? Billing one amount but expecting a premium on top of that?
15 mins early is standard here. Basically everyone expects 15 mins early to everything (work, appointments, etc). Her work is more direct about it since it’s a core part of their work, but it’s nothing unusual where we live.
Yeah I dont think 12 hours is feasible, anyway.
By hour 10, are people really working with the same level of care as when they started?
In healthcare that’s a much bigger concern than some middle-manager in a corporate office.
Three 8:15 hour shifts, instead of two 12:15 hour shifts. Seems much more reasonable, adds 15 minutes total to work time.
In theory, more medical errors happen from bad transfer of care than from fatigued caregivers, so that’s why they go for longer, fewer shifts.
Or so they say. I’m not sure I believe it.
I asked my wife about this, she said in her experience that’s true. I actually just asked her why they work 12 instead of 8 and that’s the answer she gave too.
I also mentioned it in another comment but most of her coworkers prefer the 12 hour shifts as they get a lot more days off. She said it’s busy enough that 12 in the hospital feels like 8 elsewhere so it doesn’t feel like she’s working super long shifts.
Doctors often have longer shifts too. My cousin is an anesthesiologist and works 24 hour shifts. He likes it for all the same reasons.
Well I have no reason to doubt her. Plenty of reason to doubt employers, but not the people working the shifts, so OK. Good to know.
Sounds like they should work towards 3 shorter shifts and offer enough time for a proper patient handover rather than abusing staff for over half a day.
There are 8 hour lines too but no one wants them. 12 hour days means more days off. Most people either work 2 days, 2 nights, 5 days off, or 5 weeks of lots of shifts days and nights and then one full week off.
So they should offer 8 hours and comparable days off (or even better)
None of this 12 hour bullishit should be justifiable.
Then they’d need to raise her wage too which they won’t do. She’s already well paid for her position. The more she works, the more she makes. If they raised her pay and lowered her hours so she’d get the same paycheques that would be great, but definitely wouldn’t happen. She also enjoys working. Saving people’s lives is a very fulfilling job.
12 hours aren’t bad. If I could choose 12 hours 3 days per week plus a 4 hour day instead of five 8 hour shifts I’d take that easily. Or four 10 hour days. When you’re already working 8 hours, an extra 2-4 hours isn’t bad. I used to work 12-15 hour days when they’d let me, but then they started refusing overtime so I can’t do that anymore.
Yeah, they always sell the 12 hour shifts with the tag line, “You’ll only be working 14/15 days a month!” It’s true, and I love my 5 days off in a row, but there is a huuuuge difference in an 8 hour day and a 12 hour day when you’re juggling the other necessities in your life, like kids, appointments, and emergencies.
I believe there’s studies showing that fewer handoffs lead to better patient outcomes.
I know people who prefer 12 hours shifts. My partner is scheduled for 7-7:30 shifts. Including a half hour lunch break, that means there’s a 30 minute handover window while still working 12 hours… in the end they get paid for when they are clocked in/out and not when they are scheduled.
There are some studies that show that having shifts shorter than 12h actually do more harm to patients than benefit since that means more turnover in each case and more disconnect between patient and medical professionals.
I’ve heard way crazier shifts, things like 36h shifts where I live years ago.
How much of a difference could there possibly be, regarding alleged patient harm, between 12hr and 10hr shifts?
You wouldn’t do 10h shifts, you would do 8h shifts or you would have daily drift in shifts and that’s horrible for workers.
As other people have written in this post, workers prefer 12 to 8 since there are less error and they get more vacation days.
You wouldn’t do 10h shifts
Why? I’m literally asking why 10hr isn’t even a possibility, it’s all just 8 or 12 in here. Why wouldn’t I do 10hr shifts?
Are shifts typically 12 hours due to a staffing shortages or is it for better patient care? I’m all in favor of hospitals being efficient and optimal, but if more funding is required so that the hospitals are staffed properly then I don’t see why that’s not something being funded by the government.
It’s both that 12h shifts are better for care and that people are understaffed. They need more nurses in those 12h shifts.
It’s generally perceived to be better for patient care.
https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/indhealth/48/3/48_3_357/_article/-char/ja/
There are a lot of studies looking into it, though, and it seems like it’s pretty context dependent.
That makes sense, if you’re working 12 hour shifts then at least your weeks are more predictable and you can have more baked in recovery days between shifts.
Contrasted with rotating 8 hour shifts where some of your days can be during the daylight and other shifts throughout the night, with less recovery time in between to prepare for the sweeping changes.
I just want to say, fuck rotating shifts. Those are worse than working straight nights or 3rd shifts.
Rotating shifts just sounds nuts. At that point it sounds like there was a clear hiring problem if they needed people to rotate their shifts.
I’d be all for more funding to the hospitals too. Unfortunately I don’t make those decisions. Our hospitals are already funded by the government but it would be nice if they’d give them more money for staff and equipment etc. A lot of floors are chronically low on supplies. At least the staff gets paid really well, which is a bonus. My wife makes about 2.5x what she’d make in a retirement home or similar.
deleted by creator
You’re expected to show up 15 mins early
“Expectation” means it’s not showing up 15 minutes early for a 12 hour shift, it’s 12 hour and 15 minutes shift.
She gets paid punch in to punch out. If she goes in extra early she gets paid more. If she doesn’t bother going in early to relieve the previous shift she doesn’t get the extra pay.
To overlap the next shift would have to come in early or the first would stay late.
So either you make it even harder to come in on time or you permanently institute the issue of running late.
Not to mention that would absolutely just become another dumbass all Hands-On meeting to waste everyone’s time with.
Nah people should just be there when they agreed to, being flaky is not and should not be everyone else’s problem.
That doesn’t make any sense. If you’re supposed to be there at 5:00, the shift should change so you’re supposed be there at 4:50, so that you’ll be there at 5:00 when you’re ten minutes late?
And what am I supposed to do if you do get there at 4:50? Clock out early? Feel you awkwardly hovering behind me?
I already pay for commute.
If the company isn’t paying me for extra 10 minutes, they’re not getting free 10 minutes.It shouldn’t be your problem if the next shift doesn’t show up on time.
When I used to work shifts you bet the employer paid for every extra minute I had to wait for the next guy - it’s the law.
Literally me today. My relief showed up 15 mins late. I’m now leaving like 30+ mins late because now I’m stuck in the middle of things that they should be doing.
It’s interesting to bring up air traffic controllers because they (in most countries) have strictly regulated work hours. The research into fatigue and safety problems is pretty extensive, and the last person you want working overtime because someone got sick is the controller telling a dozen or more planes where to fly at once.
While not all jobs have the same stakes, that goes to show how it’s an employer’s responsibility to account for reality.
It definitely depends on the job. I work in TV and live events. If your late you either miss the pre production meeting, or we all have to wait for you to start. If your later than that you are holding the team up and making people work harder to be ready by on-air time.
If your late
my late
Swipe keyboard and laziness. At least I showed up on time.
Yeah. It definitely depends on the job.
If you’re relieving someone, they might be annoyed if you’re late but nobody is going to die or anything. If your work isn’t extremely time sensitive, nobody should give a fuck…
If things can’t go because you’re not there, and it’s very time sensitive, then there’s a problem. Everyone is waiting on your ass to show up.
“ If your work isn’t extremely time sensitive, nobody should give a fuck…”
Except if Im staying to cover for you and I have other things I need to do or want to do I might give a fuck. The “no one should really care” POV overlooks how being late can impact others.
I had a specific exception for if you’re relieving someone.
I recognised this exact issue in my original statement.
“If you’re relieving someone, they might be annoyed if you’re late but nobody is going to die or anything.”
That’s not how I read this. I read this as you suggesting it isn’t a real problem.
It’s not a serious problem. Needs of the one vs needs of the many and all that.
It’s still discourteous.
But at the same time, people who do that kind of work, generally understand how annoying it is when their relief shows up late, so that kind of thing usually works itself out naturally… Or the chronic late person ends up needing to find a new job.
Do they minder if i stay longer? No? Then why complain when I’m late?
Its about the whole picture, am I always late? Is my work done on time and well executed ?
If so… WHO CARES ABOUT THE TIME OR PLACE I DO THAT WORK IN???
If it’s shift work and someone is waiting on you then arrive so they can go home or start to work and a team its a big deal cause you’re wasting someone elses time.
Very true. I do not do “shift work”. So I have no clue there.
Closest for me would be: being on time for meetings because of the same reason. Do not waste other peoples time.
Yeah, but how many Americans are actually doing that kind of shift work anymore? I know it’s not none, but I don’t think we’re worried about the shoe factory shutting down over this. Those factories already shut down, and managers in places like that don’t hesitate to shitcan anyone chronically 10 minutes late as an example.
More than you’d think. Any facilities that need 24 hour coverage like medical, care and of course corrections. All of which have in common the staff really don’t want to spend an extra 10-20 minutes waiting for a 20s something to show up and take offense when called out. And in my experience these 20s somethings hate any reason for them to be kept late at work.
Aaaaahh, you’re right. I totally didn’t think about medical and care facilities. I was only thinking of factory-style shift work.
How does shift work not account for overwhelming an overwhelming majority of jobs? Customer service is all shift work. That includes everything with a store front or call center. It also includes a lot of workshops. From my understanding, that is the majority of jobs.
“Shift work” in this case is more like the type where someone has to do a specific handover to another human. Not just anything that isn’t salaried work. So the meaning is more in the context of the Industrial Era 24-hour factory type of meaning, where it’s coordinated that 1 entire group leaves and another punch in at the same time. It’s just another meaning of the term.
Also, this is some clickbait garbage hating on Gen Z vs. noble brave smart Boomers with zero tolerance for tardiness - it’s their take on a survey of 1,000 adults in the UK and completely in the context of working in an office.
It depends by the job entirely, and I’ve only once as a lone bartender needed the next person in order to leave, never any other customer service jobs. You mention call centers, and I’ve never seen one that required someone else to take your place so you can leave other than Pig Butchering camps where they may or may not kill you for not performing. Call centers typically let people log in and get in the queue taking calls. Even ones with under 10 people.
Retail. It’s 100% on the companies for doing this, but cashiers, for example, usually have bare minimum staffing. If one cashier is late coming in, that probably delays someone’s lunch or someone getting to go home on time.
It’s not right, it’s not everywhere, and in a lot of places when you show up doesn’t/shouldn’t matter. But people should be mindful of the other people they impact. Slack off all you want at work, I don’t care unless it starts making more problems for me and the rest of the team.
If you are a firefighter?
Hehehe… HEY! IF the fire is out and no one died… Who cares that I just let the fire die out on his own???
You’re also there to please the mentally ill manager.
Because your lateness impacts other employees and that is unfair to them.
I can see it mattering if it’s shift work and someone else has to stay late. If it’s office work? Nah. Doesn’t matter.
Exactly. It also matters what type of shift work. If you’re late to a hospital nursing shift, that sucks because you can’t do the changeover stuff and they’ve been there 12 hours. Or if you’re the only one taking phone calls in the morning or something. In sane a world, there would be room for decent folks as well as folks who are always on time.
decent folks as well as folks who are always on time.
Decent folks are always on time, as they value your time the same as theirs.
This is the number one mistakes that dumbfucks make about decent folks, hence why I said it that way.
I haven’t met a decent person that is perpetually late. Nor one that calls me a dumbfuck.
They probably meant descent. As in the fall of society.
Haha. True
If there is no buffer for shift changes, they’re doing it wrong. Just in time is a bad model in general, but it’s horrible mismanagement for scheduling shifts.
I just have unmedicated adhd and poor time management, i’m 10 minutes late for everything, i’ll be late to my own funeral, I’m a millenial or whatever
