When I took a class to get my Concealed Carry Permit, on the very first day the instructor made a very interesting statement.
“If you are somewhere where you feel you need a gun to feel safe… Why are you there in the first place?”
While I did go on to get my permit I never once carried. I never went anywhere where I felt I needed it. If I became uncomfortable at a location, I left.
I got mine so it would be easier to transport weapons to a range. I got the weapons in case trump starts a civil war or something.
As well reciprocal states that recognize it so you can transport them with minimal issues as well. It’s one reason to get one regardless of being in a constitutional carry state.
I did self-defense training, both learning and teaching for close to 15 years or so, I did the CCW thing, took classes in firearms as well as martial arts and the whole nine-yards for many years.
I will often reiterate what you cited there, that if you’re in a dangerous situation that you already expect to be dangerous, your first priority is changing your situation. Not going to that place, working towards moving, etc. Kind of like step-one of any fight is to not get into a fight.
I eventually also stopped carrying my gun, because all it did was add extra stress to my life. Always making sure you know where it is, if you’re somewhere that legally prohibits you having it, then if you do have to leave it outside of a store or business, you are always thinking about it inside your car. My greatest worry was someone breaking into my vehicle and using the gun to commit a crime, which statistically is much, much more likely than actually being in a situation where you need to use it.
I still own guns but keep them locked up. But I don’t enjoy guns broadly because I’ve had too much time think about it. I’ve had to learn the law, I’ve had to take responsibility for teaching others how to defend themselves, I’ve spent too much time playing out situations and the post-event situations that most gun-chuds NEVER spend a moment thinking about.
I feel strongly now that a lot of the gun violence in the US can be connected to the general lack of respect and knowledge about firearms. The only “training” most owners get is action movies. I think if more people were required to actually study the law and play out scenarios they might be far less likely to reach for a gun to solve all their problems.
Interestingly, a lot of gun violence in the US comes down to neglected spaces. Without changing anything else, cleaning up vacant lots, demolishing abandoned buildings, adding street lights, and general neighborhood beautification cuts down on a LOT of gun violence. Violence intervention programs–teaching kids restraint, essentially–does a lot too.
I know that building community is not only an answer to violence, but broadly speaking the answer to a lot of social problems. I am curious though if you’re referencing a source or study, if the neighborhood beautification projects lead to people becoming more involved in their communities, or if it’s communities already coming together to beautify their neighborhoods.
Never really thought about the logistics of having to leave it in your car. Are you allowed to take the ammo in with you?
It depends a lot on your local laws. Not every state even makes the distinction, so to err on the side of caution, I always treated ammo the same as a gun, and never separated them.
Some laws let you transport guns anywhere in your car if it’s in a locked box, some laws are written in a way where that could mean your glove compartment, other states have wording that excludes a glove compartment, just as an example of the ambiguity involved in gun laws.
Also, your proximity to schools or other public services can override all the other laws. It was when I was drawing kilometer radiuses from local schools that I started to feel such stress from planning my trips outside that I decided to stop taking the damn thing out all the time, and eventually just stopped entirely.
A good CCW class will give you the most basic stuff you need to know for your area, but it does change frequently so you would need to refresh on the laws frequently.
If it’s a state/federal building you can’t even bring the ammo and that’s still the least of concern. The person getting a firearm can get replacement magazines and ammunition for it easily. People concerned for the safety of others and not wanting it stolen will get small gun safe boxes that bolt into the car someway to stow it.
I got a conceal carry and virtually never carried. The main reason I got it was because the rules for transporting your weapons/ammo without it in my state was overly convoluted. So even just going to the shooting range was more involved.
As another carry permit holder, this is most certainly true. But there are a few places I will carry due to the remoteness and some of the wildlife that can eat you if they really want to. But mostly it remains at my bedside as an “in case” if it’s needed. If something were to go sideways, law enforcement is probably going to be at least 20 to 30 minutes away and possibly up to 90 minutes. I cannot rely on either one of the two deputies on duty at 2AM to be anywhere near me if things go bad. Things will be well and done long before I can expect help.
Another thing most of the rabid “Gotta have my pistol and 3 spare mags on me at all times” never think about is the cost of shooting someone even in self-defense. By the time it’s all said and done, it can cost upwards and beyond of $100,000+ in lawyer, expert testimony, and court fees. And you are likely to lose your job due to being jailed for at least large parts of it.
But mostly it remains at my bedside as an “in case” if it’s needed. If something were to go sideways, law enforcement is probably going to be at least 20 to 30 minutes away and possibly up to 90 minutes. I cannot rely on either one of the two deputies on duty at 2AM to be anywhere near me if things go bad.
If something goes ‘sideways’ at 2AM, you expect anyone breaking into your house to ring the doorbell and wait for you to wake up?
Even if you carried at all times, and you were specifically trained (think special forces training, not I spend my weekends at the gun range training) then it’s still a toss-up if you will be able to respond fast enough. If they want to harm you, they will. You cannot be hyper-aware of your surroundings 24/7, you need to relax, you need to sleep.
I can’t imagine what life must be like when you’re so afraid that you think you need to have a gun within reach at all times.
I do not keep a gun on me at all times. Merely when hunting. I do have a first layer warning system called dogs. Hopefully the barking is all it takes to drive away a bad situation. But I WILL be awake before you can get out of your car.
And it’s not about being afraid of my surroundings. It’s about understanding that public safety, (police, fire, ems, and even neighbors), is a long ways away and I cannot expect timely help from anyone. If I have a heart attack at home, I will die for sure because EMS will never get there in time. So I need to be at least somewhat prepared for situations you don’t even consider living in a city. Where help is a mere phone call and a few minutes away. Hell, I don’t even have cell service in my yard to even call or text with.
So yes, you are at least somewhat correct. You can’t imagine.
Most people don’t sleep next to doors to the outside. Most windows are always locked. The least common way of a burglary happening is someone picking a lock.
You will be awake with a significant amount of seconds to grab a gun if someone breaks into your home.
As to doing it 24/7? Jesus, did you even read the rest of the post? That was the whole point of what you were replying to. They specifically said they think it’s true that carrying it most of the time isn’t the point.
The least common way of a burglary happening is someone picking a lock.
You don’t need a gun to defend against a burglar. Burglars are generally cowards and run away when caught. The whole point of sneaking into your house is to not be detected and commit theft. (taking something without a person noticing it).
What you might need protection from is robbery (taking things under thread of violence). A robber is not going to sneak into your house. They will either kick down your door while you sleep or simply ring the doorbell and wait for you to open. Do you bring your gun every time someone is at the door?
They specifically said they think it’s true that carrying it most of the time isn’t the point.
Then there is no point. They will just wait until you are not carrying to rob you.
There might be someone dangerous in Publix!!!
I have, it’s not fun
It happened to me once. I was sitting on the back porch on a farm in Tennessee, and there were cans on the ground about 100yds away. Things would have been better if I could have put some holes in those cans
Hope you had a backstop
Please… that sort of precautions are for pussies… USA USA USA
I’ve never been in a situation where I’d need to know how to do cpr. Yet I’ve learned how to do it.
I’m happy for you. It sucks having to use one. But it sucks more not having one and having to use one.
Not so fun fact: Gun suicides are far more common than any other type of gun related death. Having a gun in the house is a big risk factor for suicide.
Without getting into details I believe this to true.
100% I just posted a comment about how I feel like I’m more likely to kill myself than needing a gun for defense. Not that Id generally say that I’m suicidal.
Not really, suicide is historically just under half of all gun deaths. But your point stands!
It hasn’t been under half in ages. In 2023 it was 58% in the US and in some areas it’s noticeably more
Haven’t looked at numbers for 4-5 years, and holy shit did it flip around 2022-2023. Last I saw was 43-48%.
Anyone want to see for themselves, this is a solid search:
“cdc gun deaths”
Plenty of data from solid sources to back treesquid. Thanks for getting me up to date! I was quite ignorant.
What do you mean, “not really”? Is there a single type of gun-related death that is more common? Because OP is saying “the most common,” not “the majority”.
Turns out now it’s also the majority
I think you missed the point. Not what percentage of gun deaths are suicides, but what percentage of suicides are gun related.
It’s never one way. It’s not like owning a gun is driving people to suicide. It’s intersectionality that drives higher numbers.
You’re absolutely right. Owning the gun gives them the opportunity that wouldn’t exist as easily otherwise. And just for the record I’m not anti-gun.
I’ve faced many attempts to severely harm me but I usually escaped. I failed to escape twice: got kneecapped with a bat once (leaving me with a permanent injury), and stabbed once miraculously missing anything vital.
My crime: having to work late, growing up in a poor neighbourhood.
I’d feel a lot safer if I could be armed. I don’t want to die.
There are plenty self defence tools apart from guns.
That’s a hell of a thing to say to a person who has literally been stabbed.
Why? I mean if a gun could help you in that situation, some other non lethal stuff could have also been enough. At least those are enough for people not in the US facing similar situations.
Exactly I’ve never needed a gun I think its purely marketing and social expectations causing Americans to default to “muh guns” when someone’s mentioned self defense. Like if ur up against guns js wear body armour at all times rather than trying to be john wick.
I’ve been stabbed too. Ive never felt the need to carry a gun. I face a lot of risk anytime I leave my house esp rn acc due to political unrest essentially I still don’t feel the need for guns yet the government do feel the need for arming trained police (known for corruption and violence where I’m from) who I think are a lot more likely to kill me than someone w a knife. As I mentioned tho I still don’t feel the need to arm myself against those people infact doing so would worsen the situation as I’d be more of a threat and could be further used for the narrative justifying the arming of police in the first place
Edit: if an unarmed person is shot by police even if its attempted to be covered up the people who were there will know what happened. if I try to shoot the police because im threatened and they shoot back that’s going to worsen things. I don’t see how its better to carry a gun in this situation
Rule #1: Cardio
Running away saved me a lot of times. It also failed me twice, and those two times left me with a scar and a permanent disability. As a complete self-defense solution it’s a bad idea, but as part of your defense it’s a great suggestion for any able bodied people.
I can no longer outrun potential attackers. This door is closed to me.
The pig who shot Michal Brown said he had to shoot because Brown could have taken his piece away. If you accept that, then you agree that, at least in this situation, the public and the police would be safer without guns.
It used to be: I had to shoot him judge, he had a gun
Then it was: I had to shoot him judge, I thought he had a gun
Now it’s: I had to shoot him judge, I had a gun.
I have. I’ve been in places and situations where being able to get someone to back down and slow their roll would have been a better outcome than what I was able to get without being armed. Shit just happened around me, and I couldn’t exit the situation in good conscience. It’s terrifying to try to stand up to stop shit from going really sideways knowing that if it does, there’s not a lot you can do except be a meat shield for someone else. Almost all defensive gun use doesn’t involve shooting; it involves having a gun, knowing how to use it, and using the threat of force to stop someone else from escalating a situation.
People say that when seconds count, the police are only minutes away, and fuck me, that is extremely optimistic. I’ve never had the cops show up in under five minutes; the closest was about ten minutes, and that was after a shooting in my 'hood in Chicago. CPD showed up after the ambulance.
Let’s imagine that the weapons are extremely hard to get, and people can’t afford even legal ones (because of checks and prices), not to say about illegal. Wouldn’t your place be better one if that was so?
Okay, but what if my self-esteem is predicated on the knowledge that I could kill anyone at a moment’s notice.
Surely that suppressed libidinal desire to inflict unimaginable pain and suffering on everyone around me is worth something.
You’ve got a good point there… Have you ever considered using your car as a weapon against bicyclists who have indirectly offended you?
It’s incredible that we feel the need to make up monsters for our movies and ghost stories when we’ve got prime examples living amongst us.
Realistic movies scare the shit out of me. Prisoners, Blue Ruin, The Tall Man. True psychos are way scarier than any fucking ghost or demon.
A bicyclist’s very existence is offensive. But I consider the .50 mounted on the back of the pickup a more sporting way to handle things. Alternatively, mini-gun mounted from a helicopter, and if anyone asks I’ll just say I was hunting wild hogs.
Motorized bicycles?
Okay, what I said before but totally unironically for everyone in this picture except Macy.
I have lived in Oakland. I have lived in some of the seediest areas in Northern California. I have known gang members that wore colors. I have seen bikers with patches all over the place.
Not once have I been in a situation where a gun outweighs treating people like they are people.
I currently live in Oakland.
Then you know! I currently live in Vallejo.
I can see situations where having one would be handy, especially in the US, but I think the likelihood of me blowing my brains out is greater than needing one to defend myself, so I don’t have one.
When I’m at the range!
Damn you
Here’s one my conceal carry instructor taught about, and I’ve seen it play in my own life:
If you have a machine in your pocket or pants that is capable of taking a human life, you think and act differently. You’re more situationally aware, because you don’t want to stumble into a situation where you have to use the fucking thing. A concrete and steel box may be the next place you find yourself. Forever.
I lack the words to put the reader in that emotional state, but it’s real. Not like you’re paranoid, constantly on the lookout, but you are more aware. Used to put myself into crazy situations when I was younger, got stories all night long, but now I’m way more chill.
In the past, I have been threatened with violence, many times, from the homeless downtown.
Unarmed me: “FUCK YOU!”
Armed me: I’m out, not a word. More to the point, I wouldn’t be anywhere near that situation in the first place.
“But you can peace out without a gun!”
Very true, I’ll grant that. But having one makes me more aware of what’s going on around me, makes me less threatening. The vast majority of us are exactly like this. If you watch GunTubers, you will find none of them talking the way we’re made out in social media, drooling for violence. Most of the “give me an excuse” people are already in jail or dead. It’s a Darwinian thing.
The stories you hear on the news are outliers, or they wouldn’t be news. (That applies to everything else in life.)
I’ll only add this: Almost everyone in America is woefully ignorant of self-defense laws. Cops are the only shooters that can kill with impunity. You cannot, almost no matter how justified you think you are. Concrete and steel box.
Anyway, I’m sure a European from a healthy society will be right along to lecture me on how nuts I am.
“Yes, this is my emotional support firearm. Why do you ask?”
Maybe getting chill and more aware is just a function of getting older. I mean, I live in a country where nobody is armed and: I get in less dangerous situations and am more aware than in my youth.
Cops are the only shooters that can kill with impunity. You cannot, almost no matter how justified you think you are.
Tell that To Kyle Rittenhouse…
He is an exception you know about because of all the news stories. If that wasn’t the case, he would have not been more than a single blurb on the news and forgotten by morning. And he would be most likely in jail. A result you wouldn’t have heard about either.
News outlets have a vested interest in shouting up the outliers while mostly ignoring the mundane. And cops are just the group you have outsourced the killing to so you don’t have to.
Unfortunately a lot of people seem to put a hammer in their pocket because they are always looking for nails. Hammer or not.
There are untold numbers of videos, clips, tiktoks or whatever of people who refuse to walk away from an escalating situation. Out come the fists, or sometimes a gun. The comments are full of people agreeing with FAFO with no thought of walking away and the violent means and end, and plenty claim to be fine with using a gun.
I’ve been through those courses and carrying a firearm is sobering. I don’t do it anymore, and sometimes I miss it, but not enough.
UKian here to lecture you on how nuts you are: I’m sure there are cases like yours, where you will retreat from a situation because you have a deadly weapon hidden on you. I’ve known people who carried weapons and who would generally try to avoid danger. But I’m 100% positive that’s not the norm, and most people who feel the need to have a gun would react less predictably. I’ve not lived in the US, but the impression I get from media is that there are a lot of gun owners who haven’t trained with them or who are “muh freedoms” idiots.
the impression I get from the media
I think this is the issue the OP is trying to point out. There are many more silent, responsible gun owners than nuts.
Conceal and carry holders statistically are the safest segment of society for the exact reason you just gave. I would rather be in a room full of conceal and carry holders than the general public or police.
I was walking in a relatively safe part of downtown last month when two drunks suddenly started fighting over a dog 8 feet from me. I noped my way out of there. I had my gun on me but had no interest in intervening.
For the vast majority who carry we don’t want to put ourselves in a situation where you have to use it.
But yeah, I’m also sure some internet guru who has never held a gun in their life will tell me why I’m an irresponsible death machine.
I live in a duty to retreat state. And damn if this isn’t accurate. You have to be cool as a cucumber. Back out of all situations.
You just try not to put yourself into situations at all cost.
How do you plan on doing the revolution without a gun?
“Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun” -Mao
“By any means necessary” - Malcolm X
“I don’t care if I fall as long as someone else picks up my gun and keeps on shooting.” - Che Guevera
etc, etc…
“Hold mah beer. I gotta go to work.” – My Uncle defending his home.
