So obvious it shouldn’t have to be stated.
Would it be just? Sure. Would Russia agree to it even if all other demands are met and sanctions lifted? Probably not given that NATO will just rearm Ukraine and send them in when they’ve recovered. Possibly with NATO backing.
“Send them in” where?
Spell it out. Maybe say it out loud. See if it feels like a sane take.
Send them into Russia. Yes it feels entirely sane? Were you under the impression they wouldn’t be happy to send another generation of their youth into a meatgrinder? They’re doing that right now.
You are saying, given the chance, Ukraine would start a war?
That after this one ends, they’d want to continue so badly they’d become the invading side?
I mean… It’s happened before. But my country participating in operation Barbarossa alongside actual fucking nazis probably ranks among the stupidest decisions in all of recorded history.
But hey, if that’s your prediction, maybe take it to polymarket.
Correct, hence why they rejected peace proposals where Russia even gives up a portion of the land they’ve occupied and say they won’t accept anything less than Crimea.
Their leadership absolutely wants to keep fighting.
The 28-point plan was a thinly veiled temporary ceasefire that would have left Ukraine de-armed and Russia free to re-arm and try again in a couple years.
I think agreeing to it would have been like giving the bully your lunch money, then bringing twice the amount the next day thinking you’d then get to keep half.
Reality is more complex than that, of course. Maybe that peace-deal would have been the timeline with less overrall misery. But that is unknowable, and won’t become clear even in hindsight.
I meant the proposal in 2022, which was similar to the current one, except a million more Ukrainians and Russians would still be alive.
thinly veiled temporary ceasefire that would have left Ukraine de-armed and Russia free to re-arm
Well yeah, did you expect Russia to disarm? If you wanted bilateral disarmament similar to START, it would have to be between NATO and Russia, not Russia and one of America’s puppets.
