There are a lot of bad countries to be born into, I mean just look up the countries with the top number of births.

Also, reincarnation might not be limited to humans… lots of factory farm animals out there for you to be reincarnated as… 👀

Honestly its one of the reasons I wanna live this life as long as I can, I wanna delay being in Afganistan, or North Korea, or a mouse that gets killed by the housecat, or being a damn cockroach.

  • Chezus9247@lemmy.world
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    2 days ago

    What do you mean? I could just kill myself until I’m born into a rich family, that would be awesome!

    • Spacehooks@reddthat.com
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      2 days ago

      That would depend on reincarnation rules. if rerolling isint pure rng and its based in your karma level killing yourself self would lower your score.

      • Apeman42@lemmy.world
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        2 days ago

        Someone will come up with a strat to reroll into something obscure like a wood louse and farm so much positive karma with an exploit that it won’t matter how negative you were.

      • rockerface🇺🇦@lemmy.cafe
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        2 days ago

        Well, if I forget everything in the next life, that won’t be me any more. In a sense, I would be permanently gone regardless of whether it’s technically the same soul.

        • How do explain this.

          Say you had a trumatic childhood experience and repress all your memories before age 12. Did you “die” at age 12? Were your “reborn” at age 12?

          “You” is like this camera that records things. If you swap out the SD card, is it still the same camera?

          Your “soul” is the camera, the SD card is your brain.

          Get what I’m saying?

          • rockerface🇺🇦@lemmy.cafe
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            2 days ago

            Repressed memories from trauma still leave subconscious changes in behaviour, though.

            If I lost all my memories until the age of 12 and no trace of any habit or thought remained, then yes. Whoever I used to be died.

            I am my brain and the memories it contains. I am the SD card.

            • I don’t like the idea that “memory = identity”

              Memory is part of you, but doen’t solely define you.

              If someone made an identical clone of you, like every atom and molecule, even the neurons. Is that “you”? Did you split into 2?

              If we then destroy the original, are “you” still “alive”. I mean someone has the exact same memories, same atoms.

              • rockerface🇺🇦@lemmy.cafe
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                2 days ago

                That’s just Ship of Theseus and can’t be defined.

                I’m not made of the same atoms and molecules as I was a decade ago. Some of them might be still around, but it’s mostly completely new particles. Am I still the same person I was a decade ago? If not, how come I can claim ownership of stuff some other guy with the same name bought back then?

                I think I’ve read that on the quantum level you actually can’t make the exact same configuration of particles and energy levels in two places at the same time. Trying to create a copy of an object (or, in general, any configuration of particles) would inevitably cause the original to cease to exist. But it’s also mostly a thought experiment, as we can’t do that with more than a few quantum particles at a time.

                So far, as best as humanity is able to tell, your memories are you. If we ever get to Star Trek style teleportation, maybe we can define that more rigourously.

                Quick edit: I am quite enjoying this debate, though - interesting to hear other people’s takes on identity, soul and all that stuff.

                • bunchberry@lemmy.world
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                  5 hours ago

                  I tend to agree with people like Wittgenstein, Bohm, Engels, and Benoist, that identities are ultimately socially constructed. Aristotle believed identifies are physically real, so that a tree or a ship physically has an identity of “tree” or a “ship.” But then naturally you run into the Ship of Theseus paradox, but many other kinds of paradoxes of the same sort like Water-H2O paradox or the teletransportation paradox, where it becomes ambiguous as to when this physical identity would actually come into existence and when it goes away.

                  The authors that I cited basically argue that identities are all socially constructed. “Things” don’t actually have physical existence. They are human creations.

                  One analogy I like to make is that they’re kind of like a trend line on a graph. Technically, the trend line doesn’t add any new information, it just provides a simplified visual representation of the overall data trend of the data, but all that information is already held within the original dataset.

                  Human brains have limited processing capacity. We cannot hold all of nature in our head at once, so we simplify it down to simplified representations of overall patterns that are relevant and important to us. We might call that rough collection of stuff over there a “tree” or a “ship.” The label “tree” or “ship” represents an overly simplified concept of some relevant properties of interest about that stuff over there, but if you go analyze that stuff very closely, you may find that the label actually is rather ambiguous and doesn’t capture the fully complexities of that stuff.

                  Indeed, if we could somehow hold all of nature in our heads simultaneously, we would not need to divide the world into “things” at all. We would just fully comprehend how it all interacts as a single woven unified whole, and the introduction of any “thing,” any identity, would just be redundant information.

                  Indeed, to some extent, it has always been both necessary and proper for man, in his thinking, to divide things up, and to separate them, so as to reduce his problems to manageable proportions; for evidently, if in our practical technical work we tried to deal with the whole of reality all at once, we would be swamped…However, when this mode of thought is applied more broadly…then man ceases to regard the resulting divisions as merely useful or convenient and begins to see and experience himself and his world as actually constituted of separately existent fragments…fragmentation is continually being brought about by the almost universal habit of taking the content of our thought for ‘a description of the world as it is’. Or we could say that, in this habit, our thought is regarded as in direct correspondence with objective reality. Since our thought is pervaded with differences and distinctions, it follows that such a habit leads us to look on these as real divisions, so that the world is then seen and experienced as actually broken up into fragments.

                  — David Bohm, “Wholeness and the Implicate Order”

            • Isolde@lemmy.world
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              2 days ago

              You aren’t your brain, your brain and body are completely apart from you and don’t care what you’d like. If you were your brain you could stop beating your heart at will, stop digesting, stop or start functions that you are in control of. You’re not in control of anything; not even what you are seeing. Just your perspective and what you make of those experiences. Also, the change in behavior is also mostly up to your body and brain; not you. If you’re hungry, your judgement is clouded and skews towards the negative, not because that is your want.

              • rockerface🇺🇦@lemmy.cafe
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                2 days ago

                If I was completely in control of my identity, I could stop being bisexual at will. Not a very compelling argument.

                • Isolde@lemmy.world
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                  2 days ago

                  Sorry, where did I say you were?

                  Actually, you and I are saying the same thing. There isn’t a lot you control about yourself. Did you even read the argument in question?

                  • rockerface🇺🇦@lemmy.cafe
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                    2 days ago

                    Your argument - if I understood it correctly - was that I’m not my brain because I’m not in complete control of my brain. But then I’m not in complete control over what most people would agree is part of my identity.