Dbzero Governance Vote Post https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/63525728
Ahoy mateys!
A few of our users have recently pointed out that a lot of the pro-Zionist accounts on the fediverse nowadays seem to come from the feddit.org instance.
But whatever the excuse happens to be, they need to do better imo. Israel is currently the most violent, fascist and genocidal nation state in the Middle East (if you exclude the US military bases there). And yet feddit.org seems to regard the Palestinians fighting against Israel’s ongoing illegal occupation of their land as the real terrorists. …
More context
Our instance already voted to ban pro-Zionist accounts (see https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/60585441 for reference) and the rule that was implemented is here: Golden Rule #8.
As further context, you can find relevant comments and discussion in this post by a banned feddit admin in MoG (that fact they chose to post in MoG is in itself quite telling), and this post about their defederation from quokk.au over anti-semitism allegations has recently become active again. …
Note 2: If you think feddit.org deserves a full instance ban instead, or have alternative suggestions, then please leave your comments below. If enough people think that’s the better option, then we’ll do that instead.
In the end the Post had around 70% of support by dbzer0 users, who in the comments also called for defederation.
Here is a Link to Dbzer0 instances tab https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/instances where if you go to blocked instances you can see fedddit.org is now defederated
i dont think feddit has made a post now, but when they do i will add it
All violence in a settler colony, including the violence perpetrated by and against the colonizers, is the fault of the colonizers.
You’re right, they should be given:
to make sure they can more efficiently kill only soldiers.
Since we’re wishing for things, I also wish every “Israeli” genocide supporter would just disappear without the resistance having to do anything.
What a dehumanising and despicable statement. The people murdered by Hamas did nothing wrong. Certainly nothing that could justify their deaths. They did not colonise anything either; they were simply born there.
This conflict really brings out the worst in some people. On the one hand, they blame the murder of innocent people on colonialism, and on the other, on the alleged human shield tactic.
This contextualisation, relativisation and, in some cases, romanticisation of human suffering is absolutely disgusting and must stop.
It’s extremely telling that you read this:
And concluded that it meant “every ‘Israeli’ who died deserved it”. It actually meant “some of them didn’t deserve to die, but their deaths are still the fault of ‘Israel’ because it’s a colonial project that cause this to happen”.
Yeah, it did happen because of colonialism. It’s also extremely telling that you present these statements as equivalent, as if “‘Israel’ is a settler colony” and “Hamas use human shields” are equally valid statements. The first is a very basic, correct analysis of the nature of the state, which the most important early zionists (such as Herzl and Ben Gurion) not only agreed with but were proud of. The second is a racist lie designed to try to excuse genocide.
“Israel” literally uses human shields, by the way. They have actually tied human beings to the front of their vehicles in the past.
My point is that you gloss over the suffering of innocent people while excusing the actions of the respective murderers, just as people on the other side do. Namely, as a necessary and inevitable consequence of the other leaders’ actions. You argue structurally against the innocent victims using the same logic as the supporters of the IDF.
It is a reversal of perpetrator and victim to appease your own conscience. An exaggerated and thus dehumanising tribalism that draws legitimacy for crimes against innocent people from the crimes of another group of actors. It is a misanthropic and cynical logic with which any atrocity could be justified (which is, of course, done constantly around the world).
Hamas and IDF supporters are equally malicious and disgusting. The murder of innocent people is always and fundamentally wrong. Leftists must reject and fight it.
As long as there is colonialism there will be violent resistance. This violence as well as the initial violence of the colonizers is the fault of the colonizers.
I’m sure some innocent Germans were killed during WW2 by resistance fighters, but the reason it happened was because of the actions of Germany. Without the colonization, it would not have happened and if you focus on it to condemn the resistance fighters then people will correctly identify you as a nazi.
Like the nazis who make those arguments about WW2, you are attempting to justify your opposition to resistance and therefore your support of genocide.
It is one thing when innocent people die in armed conflicts. That is bad enough. But it is much worse when innocent people are deliberately targeted. That is simply inexcusable and not the fault of the Netanyahu government. Hamas cannot claim to be resisting when its targets are not the groups or institutions that oppress the Palestinians. One can only come to such a conclusion if one adopts Hamas’ interpretation of who the oppressors are. Namely, all Jews or Israelis by virtue of their origin.
I do not think we can agree on this. My view of humanity is fundamentally different from yours. Discussing normative principles is pointless. However, I find your attitude so cynical and appalling that I no longer wish to engage in further debate. I very rarely do this, but I have now blocked you.
Ukraine has targeted and killed civilians in the Russia Ukraine war, so I guess you also believe that Ukraine can’t claim it’s resisting Russia? (Rhetorical question, of course, I know you apply a different standard to white people.)