Especially a couple thousand years ago, the Sahara was far smaller, and far lest hostile to life. The last trees only died in the Sahara about 20 or 30 years ago. Caravans crossed regularly. On top of the very easy route from Sudan to Egypt, and the Greeks were obsessed with Egypt. Even the Bible talks about Nubians in Ancient Egypt, so if even that as a “source” knows about the well-documented reality that Sub-Saharan populations were in contact and well-known individuals present in North Africa and the Levant as far back as 5,000 years ago.
I mean, did you not even think to search for this before spouting off? Literally the first search result for “did black people greece”:
“See! I told you that we could get them to pay for the wall!”
“That’s very good sir, but still, what the fuck are we supposed to do with all these giant wooden horses? And isn’t it suspicious that they drop off a new one every day?”
“Fake news! We have the most, the biggest and the best giant wooden horses! We’ll give them to our giants wooden cowboys to ride! Just yesterday a giant wooden cowboy, the biggest wooden cowboy you have ever seen, came up to me with tears in his eyes, tears just streaming down his wooden face. And he said thank you!. Thank you for the giant wooden horses! Until you we had nothing to ride and had to chase the giant wooden cows around on foot.”
This period ended right around when recorded history begins. Because the Sahara was not hostile it created a corridor for plants, and animals, and people to make an easy crossing into the levant and then further into Asia and Europe.
Yeah, it’s wild how there’s just a 5cm thick layer of salt down under the sand, and mining salt slabs from the ancient sea is how most nomadic groups flavor their food.
Plus all the rock art and ancient cities just out in the middle of nowhere today. I once bought a dinosaur tooth from a guy that 1) agreed with claims I had heard that the mountains in the Sahara still harbor things like peach trees, and 2) that there are badlands style areas where herders just find dinosaur bones lying around.
…the first search result being about a community that in its largest part started existing in 1923 is relevant to ancient history?
I mean I don’t know enough about ancient demographics to comment on whether there would feasibly be more than an extremely tiny minority of sub-saharan africans in ancient greece, but claiming someone didn’t search and then providing an irrelevant search result has a certain irony to it.
Thanks, now I know a little more about ancient greek demographics! Well it still seems to be mainly about greeks in africa, but some exchange both ways seems inevitable when it’s that prominent.
It goes both ways. Ultimately, it’s that the Greeks (and Romans) were obsessed with Egypt, and Egypt was in direct and lasting contact with the Nubians (modern Sudan) and parts of modern Ethiopia because they were farther up the Nile.
Might get to see it sooner this time. If the Atlantic current that brings warm water up to the Baltic sea stops, it could mean more rain in Africa (and more ice in Europe).
I said North Africans weren’t black. Are you perhaps mistaking me for the person in the OP? Because you’re seemingly going after points I’ve never made
Your link is about modern Greece btw. Did you read it before posting?
And I’m not confusing you with OP, I’m explaining that North Africa was not bordered on the south by an impenetrable desert and that thinking only North African peoples were in Ancient Greece really mid-understands geography and proximity to Africa and the commonality of trade along the Nile. Going east, Ancient Buddhists started depicting Shakyamuni Budda as a human figure and not an empty space under a tree directly as the result of Greek philosophical exchange. Buddhist “missionaries” are accounted for in Athens and the Levant more than 2000 years ago.
Ancient Greece was a pretty cosmopolitan place for the ancient world.
Your link is the opposite situation to what we’re talking about. It is talking about Greeks in Africa, not (sub-Saharan) Africans in Greece.
African Greeks, or Greeks in Africa (Greek: Έλληνες της Αφρικής), are the Greek people in the continent of Africa. Greek communities have existed in Africa since antiquity.
Ancient Greece was a pretty cosmopolitan place for the ancient world.
Right, I’m just saying the contacts were more common with North Africans, who weren’t black. But there were contacts for sure. Depends on who the black person is portraying if there’s any cause for the outrage.
Oh fun history time!
Especially a couple thousand years ago, the Sahara was far smaller, and far lest hostile to life. The last trees only died in the Sahara about 20 or 30 years ago. Caravans crossed regularly. On top of the very easy route from Sudan to Egypt, and the Greeks were obsessed with Egypt. Even the Bible talks about Nubians in Ancient Egypt, so if even that as a “source” knows about the well-documented reality that Sub-Saharan populations were in contact and well-known individuals present in North Africa and the Levant as far back as 5,000 years ago.
I mean, did you not even think to search for this before spouting off? Literally the first search result for “did black people greece”:
Edit: meant to paste this link - my bad - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_Greeks https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Greeks
gasp
people migrate and stuff?
bewildered
Why didn’t the Greeks build a wall? Are they stupid?
They did but people kept sneaking in on giant wooden horses
“See! I told you that we could get them to pay for the wall!”
“That’s very good sir, but still, what the fuck are we supposed to do with all these giant wooden horses? And isn’t it suspicious that they drop off a new one every day?”
“Fake news! We have the most, the biggest and the best giant wooden horses! We’ll give them to our giants wooden cowboys to ride! Just yesterday a giant wooden cowboy, the biggest wooden cowboy you have ever seen, came up to me with tears in his eyes, tears just streaming down his wooden face. And he said thank you!. Thank you for the giant wooden horses! Until you we had nothing to ride and had to chase the giant wooden cows around on foot.”
They did, actually. To keep the Ottomans out. Didn’t work (spoiler).
They also did that with the Persians, though instead of bricks they used Spartans.
And to add on to your point about the Sahara being less hostile, it used to be filled with life.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_humid_period
This period ended right around when recorded history begins. Because the Sahara was not hostile it created a corridor for plants, and animals, and people to make an easy crossing into the levant and then further into Asia and Europe.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sahara_pump_theory
Yeah, it’s wild how there’s just a 5cm thick layer of salt down under the sand, and mining salt slabs from the ancient sea is how most nomadic groups flavor their food.
Plus all the rock art and ancient cities just out in the middle of nowhere today. I once bought a dinosaur tooth from a guy that 1) agreed with claims I had heard that the mountains in the Sahara still harbor things like peach trees, and 2) that there are badlands style areas where herders just find dinosaur bones lying around.
…the first search result being about a community that in its largest part started existing in 1923 is relevant to ancient history?
I mean I don’t know enough about ancient demographics to comment on whether there would feasibly be more than an extremely tiny minority of sub-saharan africans in ancient greece, but claiming someone didn’t search and then providing an irrelevant search result has a certain irony to it.
That’s my bad, I had 2 links open in 2 tabs and copied the wrong one.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_Greeks
Thanks, now I know a little more about ancient greek demographics! Well it still seems to be mainly about greeks in africa, but some exchange both ways seems inevitable when it’s that prominent.
It goes both ways. Ultimately, it’s that the Greeks (and Romans) were obsessed with Egypt, and Egypt was in direct and lasting contact with the Nubians (modern Sudan) and parts of modern Ethiopia because they were farther up the Nile.
So we’re confident that black people did in fact greece.
It’s well-documented that black Greeks did.
It’s on a long term cycle 50kyears ish where it goes from green to dry.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hadley_cell
Well, it was.
Might get to see it sooner this time. If the Atlantic current that brings warm water up to the Baltic sea stops, it could mean more rain in Africa (and more ice in Europe).
I said North Africans weren’t black. Are you perhaps mistaking me for the person in the OP? Because you’re seemingly going after points I’ve never made
Your link is about modern Greece btw. Did you read it before posting?
I pasted the wrong link, which is my mistake - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_Greeks
And I’m not confusing you with OP, I’m explaining that North Africa was not bordered on the south by an impenetrable desert and that thinking only North African peoples were in Ancient Greece really mid-understands geography and proximity to Africa and the commonality of trade along the Nile. Going east, Ancient Buddhists started depicting Shakyamuni Budda as a human figure and not an empty space under a tree directly as the result of Greek philosophical exchange. Buddhist “missionaries” are accounted for in Athens and the Levant more than 2000 years ago.
Ancient Greece was a pretty cosmopolitan place for the ancient world.
Your link is the opposite situation to what we’re talking about. It is talking about Greeks in Africa, not (sub-Saharan) Africans in Greece.
Right, I’m just saying the contacts were more common with North Africans, who weren’t black. But there were contacts for sure. Depends on who the black person is portraying if there’s any cause for the outrage.