The account you’re explaining is a sterling example of why defederating from Hexbear is a good idea. I’d forgotten what Chapo trolling was like, but it’s very much this. Just sort of immature vaguely-confusing “ironic” trolling over and over again. They’re fishing for a ban and will no doubt go celebrate it somewhere else when they get it, but until they get it they’ll just make comment sections dumber.
It’s never going to be literally 100% of users on an instance. It’s more of a balancing act of “is the communication with this instance a net positive for our users”. It takes a good amount of unmoderated toxicity to balance out the benefit of just regular old communication, but it doesn’t need to be literally everyone all the time.
The user didn’t ask about being banned for breaking rules, they asked about being banned for “being an asshat”.
Non-federation with a CTH-successor certainly makes running a community on lemmy.world more desirable. Back on reddit, before the bannings about 1/3 of mod actions were from TD users, 1/3 were from CTH users, and the last 1/3 was just randos. It’s not like CTH was just a regular sub, they were the source of a lot of moderation.
I read the statement that was linked here, and it just seemed like they were saying that they should be respectful and follow our rules?
Read through some of the first set of links if you haven’t. The same admin who’s trying to gently suggest they don’t troll is talking about how their instance won’t brigade lemmygrad because the energy is better focused on the wider war against liberalism in the fediverse. It calls into question exactly how real that suggestion is vs. just a pro-forma attempt to head off this exact result with a toothless suggestion they know no one is going to follow.
Do you really believe that will stop their users from trolling? They explicitly say that they won’t impose consequences for actions on other instances, so it’s basically just a friendly suggestion. Add to it their statement’s elsewhere implying there will be non-lemmygrad brigading and it’s kind of hard to believe they really care all that much about their users not trolling “the libs”.
Carcosa (i.e., the same person who said follow the rules on other instances):
So lets say hypothetically I get banned for being an asshat on another instance.I wont get banned on hexbear ? Right ? (Not that I plan on causing trouble)
That is correct
And them on lemmygrad:
I can assure you there will be no lemmygrad brigades, that energy would be better funneled into the current war against liberalism on the wider fediverse
A single login solution is to find a third party that federates with both lemmy.world and hexbear. Hexbear’s list is pretty limited so it’d have to be one of those, but unless others follow lemmy.world’s choice you’ll be able to see and post on both instances.
I think their admins are doing an honest job trying to put out reminders for good behavior (**edit: I hadn’t originally followed the links to the admin’s comments elsewhere, I no longer think they’re doing an honest job), the problem is that the sub they grew from never heeded similar admonishments and their federation post explicitly says they will not be moderated for activity outside of hexbear, so it’s really just a suggestion, not a rule.
I don’t agree with anti-western ideology being a good reason for defederation, but I do expect hexbear to be a major source of trolling from past experience with r/CTH. Reddit post-Donald and post-CTH bans was a noticeably less trolly (NOT saying they’re even remotely equivalent, just both were sources of trolling and were banned at the same time).
Fucking lol. This has to trolling too. No chapo could possibly be surprised people think of them as trolls. Most of them are proud of it.
This is the same argument about banning on Reddit, but as a former mod, my experience is that very few people will actually go through the effort to spin up an alt to keep trolling. A handful will (we had one person who put a note in their calendar to send a “mean” modmail every month for a weirdly long time), but most are just lazy bored posters who have fun messing with people they don’t like, and if they can’t conveniently browse their targets for opportunities, they’ll just go do something else they find fun rather than go through the effort. Despite accounts being basically free and meaningless, banning trolls was unexpectedly effective.
CTH did more than just troll, but doing something in addition to trolling doesn’t make you not a troll. Most of the rest of Reddit didn’t experience the fun in-sub content, they just experienced its trolling and brigading, and we don’t need to pretend that Hexbear and r/CTH aren’t largely one and the same. They don’t need federation to do the internal culture stuff you’re waxing poetic about, they need federation to troll.
And I couldn’t care less whether calling CTH or your thousands of friends trolls is going to make you hostile. THEY were hostile to other people because it was fun for them. The trolling is already here via the OP. It’s tiresome and just degrades forums for their targets and everyone not in on the joke trying to figure out what their issue is. You guys don’t get to spend years trolling reddit just to say “we have a new name now, so you can’t judge us on our prior actions”.
Maybe admins will wait and see. If somehow it isn’t a huge source of trolling then I fully support federating. But I’m going to say I don’t think the odds are good. And if the admins do what you expect and don’t go back and revisit the choice I can’t say I’m going to think it’s a huge loss.
Alternately make non-troll leftists join a non-troll instance if they want to just go out into the wider Fediverse without the stigma. Once they federate they won’t have to be on the CTH-successor instance, they’re choosing to be there. Like I said in my other reply to you, I don’t find the lemmygrad users nearly as trollish as CTH was. It’s not the ideology that’s the problem, it’s the trolling, and they’re pre-announcing they won’t do anything to curb trolling by their users.
CTH wasn’t just a sub that happened to have some users who also trolled, they frequently organized and bragged about trolling and brigading there. And while mods need to be ready to ban individual trolls, it’s also a volunteer activity and not dealing with a rotating cast of trolls or massive brigades could be worth shutting out some posters who wouldn’t be a problem themselves. I don’t think it’s an unreasonable stance to say “wait and see if it’s a problem”, but I also don’t think it’s an unreasonable stance to say “we know what’s likely going to happen, we’re not robots who have to pretend we were born yesterday”.
I don’t really mind lemmygrad users. They’re often pretty tankie, but I don’t see much trolling from them. They state their opinion about China/Russia and frequently get downvoted, but I haven’t seen them explicitly try to be disruptive to communities/people they don’t like.
Eh, so be it. CTH made its own bed and in the thread talking about federating users are demonstrating why people should be skeptical of the value of federating with a troll-prone instance. The mods of CTH back in the day also sometimes asked their users to behave themselves, it didn’t really work. And since their admins have explicitly said they won’t police trolling elsewhere, it’s really nothing more than a passing suggestion.
In an ideal world, lemmy.world waits and sees if they’re really committed to keeping their shit on local. In a non-ideal world never federating with instances extremely likely to troll is also a pretty good choice.
CTH was kind of a problematic sub (quite separate from the claimed “don’t be mean to slaveholders” reason for their banning), so I’m not really opposed to not welcoming a mirror of a sub known for brigades and trolling other communities with open arms. Maybe their new administration/moderation/community is better, but lemmy.world can always federate after they’ve demonstrated that elsewhere.
Post karma and comment karma don’t map to questions and answers though. Maybe in some very specific subs posting=questions, but most post karma is posting links and memes.
From a brief browse, it looks like the day of the week is mostly hashtag spam, presumably for the purpose of trying to get noticed by using an easy and reliable trending hashtag. I saw one post about the Wednesday Addams TV show, but everything else was literally the day of the week. About half of the uses were in long lists of hashtags.
I think the #tuesday hashtag isn’t really what normal people talk about, but probably people gaming the system to get on a reliably trending hashtag.
No, Beehaw users posting in Beehaw communities visible on Lemmy.world. There’s no third party interaction on either of those posts (just the Beehaw OP and Lemmy.world comments). Whether or not Beehaw is doing the convenience of sending updates, their content is accessible through Lemmy.world. It might take some action on a user here to trigger a pull, but it’s entirely possible and you shouldn’t expect defederation to prevent an intrusive instance from continuing to get content if they want it.
I don’t know for sure there isn’t some pathway through another instance causing this, but in my understanding that’s not how federated communities work. There’s the owner instance that has the true version of the content and distributes it around and then local copies on each other server that feed their updates back to the main instance. You wouldn’t ever take a third party’s version of a community because you couldn’t trust its legitimacy.
Federation only duplicates stuff an instance’s users subscribe to, so if you’re a single user instance it wouldn’t copy anything you don’t see (if you actually vet your subscriptions and regularly view their content).